A collection of notes about classical guitars, nylon strings and related topics. Classical Guitar Notebook. I was privileged to have found a few areas to contribute a little to the existing version after carefully going over the sheet music. I prefer it because of all the versions out there, I hear the story most clearly with her presentation. It is perhaps a little ironic since her demeanor is probably the most deadpan in terms of body language, but I've always felt that she heard the story beneath better than most.
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I am VERY excited to have found this place. I've been working on the Koyunbaba on and off for quite some time now, having taken quite a few extended breaks, but I am at it again and making some progress into Movement III. I have found it to be excellent in spite of a now-corrected error in the first mvt , but I realize that tabs are usually more prone to error in general terms. I realize that using tabs is probably posionous, lecherous talk for the skilled folk on this forum, but this is basically the third song I have ever attempted to learn, so I'm pretty happy about my progress so far.
I can almost keep up with Li Jie to around on YT. So my question is regarding the 2nd measure after the harmonic in the arpeggios. It's the 32nd measure of the Cantabile. Page 7 of the complete suite in my copy. However, in the 32nd measure, the slur is missing.
This would indicate plucking the 2nd string a second time. This is uncomfortable and distracting which I think is part of the fun of playing this piece - plenty of stuff is similar but just a little different and keeps you on your toes , but worse, it sounds weird.
I understand that the Koyunbaba is a highly interpretative piece and is meant to allow a bit of personal style, but I feel there is so much in the music itself that I would prefer to try to bring out what Carlo wrote before adding my own flavor. Can anyone help me out by checking this? Is there more than one version of the sheet music out there?
I'm using the Pak-TaeYun version. Thank you. There is a 'tic tock' sound, almost a mechanical clockwork type sound coming through. Very rhythmic and quite stirring imho. Of all the techniques I have learned since starting this out as a totally green beginner fumbling around trying to get C, F and G chords right, I have figured them all out and practiced some of them to a half decent level. I cannot understand this technique.
What is she doing to make this sound? I have listened to this piece literally thousands of times it's my alarm to wake up and it plays twice. I am quite comfortably obsessed with it as you can see. I have listened to dozens of other performers and none of them seem to have this technique in their playing. It kind of sounds like a fret sound, like a forced buzz, muted quickly. I don't know if it's intentional or a flaw, but it has too much regularity and it only shows up in that brief section.
I have asked all my guitarist friends and not surprisingly, they haven't a clue. I have no friends who are into CG. Asking local music teachers has also yielded nothing. I am currently living overseas in Taiwan and while language isn't a barrier at this point, this song isn't exactly Suzuki Method Level 1. I've actually got half a mind to just buy a plane ticket to China and go see if I can find Li Jie.
Heck, I think I'd make a documentary about it! Actually, I just might do that after I get the song figured out and nicely practiced. Might have to do it on a rickety old bicycle, with a guitar on my back to make it marketable though I wonder what would take longer, perfecting the song or growing my hair and goatee long enough to make a compelling backpacker musicumentary Thanks for the help. In the mean time, would you mind heading over to the "Introduce Yourself" forum and having a go at that?
Appreciate it--we do like to get to know a bit about our new members Regards, oski There is no 32nd measure on page 7, you have five lines each four measures long 20 measures in total.
The 'tick tock' sound is just hammering firmly onto the open 4th string as she ascends and decends, metal hitting metal. New strings will accentuate that kind of sound and the guitar itself will impart its own signature harmonic overtones. Playing this piece as tempo gives you lots of effects like this. PS don't post in green and blue, its hard to read.
PPS I would suggest that attemping Koyunbaba as your 'third song' you are a little out of your depth. Twelve minute concert pieces in four movements are not exactly beginner repertoire. This is critical to the Koyunbaba and the highlighted notes in the middle of arpeggios must be clear. The slurs are indicating 'tied notes' as you say. But when playing them - particularly in this section, there is no 'slur' technique like a mordent, just a sustain. I think you are referring to tied notes - when two notes of the same value are tied like that the second instance of the note is not played but sustained from the first, those are ties not slurs.
Count from the beginning of the movement. I cannot guarantee that everyone reading my post is using the same version of sheet, so I have no idea what page it will show up on.
It shows up on page 7 on my copy. Sorry, I usually like to use a lighter shade of grey, but the color selector in the post editor here doesn't have any grey tones. I thought blue and green would show the questions more clearly. It's hard. But it has been a great challenge and I'm in no hurry. I just take it a little bit at a time. I will probably submit a video to vimeo in a month or so. In the meantime, I will continue to try.
Anyhow, so I was reading Douglas Niedt's 'tip' on slurs and he brings up an interesting point. Slurs seem to be a transcription point but are not always played the same way. I am getting very close to the 4th movement and I have already started practicing the left hand fingering and I am realizing that the pulloff technique is a lot more complicated than it seems at first.
I used to use the rather poor form on-off for mordents and I still use this in some places like in the quick descent mordent section from the 16th fret - but this is more because my string likes to slip off the fret that Douglas describes as 'free slurs'. This can be pulled off with good tone if I am very firm. But looking at the 4th movement and the quickly ascending section in the 2nd movement , a curious things I have discovered is that some parts of the guitar neck respond very poorly to the same movement.
The timing of the pulloff makes a big difference. So in these cases, a quick 'free slur' is not very useful. A snap-off is much more consistent. The same would then hold true for the 4th movement - in fact, even more so, since speed, rhythmic punctuality and clarity of the 2nd note are absolutely critical to preventing an unholy train wreck screaming down the rails. Reading Douglas Niedt's article, he speaks about his use of slurs in the context of playing pieces originally intended for bowed instruments which the Koyunbaba is not and examining the response from instrumentalists of those original instruments.
Their comment was that they preferred the arrangements without the pull-off techniques, favoring the evenness of plucking each note. So that opens the possibility of playing the 4th movement with this style, using a 2 finger 'tremolo' for cleanness and evenness. I am curious about what others might think about this.
Is this the way you've always played it? Tried it for a while but went back to good form snapping pull-offs? What's your take? I don't think this is an issue of difficulty since each technique is roughly the same and neither is particularly difficult as techniques go I've got one version of the RDLA that has me doing a mordent on the middle note of a fast tremolo.
I'm not sure it's accurate, but I did actually manage it. And there's a certain amount of freedom of choice with your style in the Koyunbaba as well. I know what I think about this. I guess I should your response as now I know what Blondie thinks about this too.
Surely there are others here who are familiar with this piece The Koyunbaba was written for guitar, but it is also known as a piece in which Domeniconi encourages some level of improvisation and personal style. I have seen people using Rasgueados a very Spanish style in a piece intended to have a Turkish sound. I have heard people using hard attack where others use legato and fast speeds in Mosso and Moderato sections.
Clearly not everyone is sticking to the exact same techniques to reproduce their idea of the sound. I have asked this in this forum because I am looking for the ideas of how people familiar with the piece view these two similar techniques in that specific section in the beginning of the 4th movement.
I am not asking this in a violin forum. I was merely showing where I got the idea to consider this possible variation. Generations of fretted players did not use tablatures because they were poorly educated, or because they did not care about the composer's intentions When you retune a guitar as drastically as in K, staff notation becomes a huge obstacle to the performer.
The inelegant solution in K to notate it on two staves, one which makes no musical sense at all, is, to my mind, way too complex and does nothing for the music. Likewise, tablature without rhythms placed below a stave of notation are too information heavy. I think this type of tab puts many an educated musician off - and rightly so!
Koyunbaba - IV - Presto by Carlo Domeniconi tabs download
Koyunbaba - Tab Guitar